Alternator - bare wires

Started by Phil C, 23 Feb, 2021, 16:49

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Phil C

23 Feb, 2021, 16:49
Bess did say if it ain't broke don't fix it. But I thought whilst I'm in the primary chaincase I may as well reposition my alternator stator, as it had been put in the wrong way round by a previous owner. Last time I was in the primary chaincase I just put it back in the same way (if it ain't broke...) but this time I decided to reposition it so that it would be as its supposed to be. As part of doing that I decided to replace the old, hard, brittle sleeving through which the three wires run.  To do that I took the stator off completely, ie disconnected at the bullet connectors above the primary chaincase and pulled the sleeved wires through the grommets.   On the bench, looking more closely, I see that there are some bare wires. If you look at the photo you'll see (arrowed) the insulation has split where the wires bend, exposing the bare copper strands. Could someone kindly advise me what to do please? This is new ground for me, so please assume no previous knowledge! It just looks like a little jumble of wires and blobs of solder to me. Thanks very much in advance.    Phil

Bess

#1
23 Feb, 2021, 17:59
Hi,
    Opps  ;)

Carefully cut off the black outer insulator to expose the wires. Individually fit closely fitting shrink sleeves over the full length of each of the wires, shrink them with a hairdryer. Then fit an outer sleeve of your choice over all three of the wires.

You might consider finishing with strain relief as suggested in your other post.

Best wishes...

DAVE BRADY

#2
23 Feb, 2021, 18:07
Hi,

Make sure the wires are very clean so that the heat shrink will stay in place.  Electrical contact cleaner will do a good job.  This could be the original stator so check that all the coils are very secure and that the lacquer on the coils has not started to come off.  These were superseded by the encapsulated type.

Dave.

Phil C

#3
23 Feb, 2021, 18:24
Things have taken a turn for the worse. :(

When trying to very carefully remove the outer sleeving (quite difficult in that it's rock hard, softens when heated with a hot air gun but then cools and hardens almost immediately), here's what I found (see photo.) A broken wire, and another that's bent sharply and not looking great. I must have done it, despite being very careful. To make myself feel a bit better I think the copper might be brittle. 

Help!

Phil

DAVE BRADY

#4
23 Feb, 2021, 19:19
Hi,

How good are you at soldering?  If the rest of the stator is in good condition and you like a challenge cut off the wires and start with new wires and sleeving.  If not get a new encapsulated stator.  Personally that is what I would do as I am not that good at soldering.

Dave.

Phil C

#5
23 Feb, 2021, 19:31
Not sure how to check if the rest of thevstatorbudbinbgoid condition.
I used to be able to solder after a fashion, when I worked in a metalwork/ machine shop, but that was decades ago and I never did an alternator. But I've been thinking about buying some soldering gear. Maybe I should do that and have a go - assuming lots of  forum advice! - and if I fail then buy a new stator. I guess just melt the existing joints and solder on new wires? Is it a bit more difficult than that? Are there any parts of the stator which don't like heat?  Phil

Phil C

#6
23 Feb, 2021, 19:33
By the way, that gobbledegook in my last post was meant to say " the stator is in good".  Phil

DAVE BRADY

#7
23 Feb, 2021, 19:48
Hi Phil,

I would be looking at the coils - are they loose?  Are the insulating cards in good condition and all there?  The wires in the coils are coated with, I think a shellac lacquer, which should be intact so no bright copper visible.  The wires connecting the coils need to be in good condition with the insulation intact.  If it has over heated it may have a smell to it and be discoloured.  Ultimately if it looks good then it can be checked electrically but some one else will have to advise on this but there could be info. in you workshop manual re testing a stator.

Dave. 

Phil C

#9
23 Feb, 2021, 20:46
Never seen those before. Had to Google them to see how they work. So Bess you're suggesting I simply join the two ends of the broken wire with a solder sleeve, using a heat gun to make the joint and seal. Seems temptingly simple. Do you reckon the material is oilproof and okay in prolonged heat inside the primary chaincase?  Phil

Bess

#10
23 Feb, 2021, 21:36 Last Edit: 23 Feb, 2021, 21:38 by Bess
Hi Phil,
           They will be fine, probably best to use Duraseal for your particular application. They are good from -55degC TO +125degC, resistant to motor oil, diesel etc. See data sheets on this page.

https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/splice-connectors/0533673/

I would practice a few times first as you don't want to overheat them during installation.

Best wishes...

Phil C

#11
23 Feb, 2021, 21:39
Actually, just noticed one of the wires has insulation damage very close to the stator, so maybe it's either soldering on new wires or buying a new stator. Need to think and decide.  Phil

Mike Farmer

#12
24 Feb, 2021, 10:30
 :) :) :)

I would consider it in these terms.

If you do a repair will you be 100% (or close) happy with it. if you are never going to be more than a very few miles from home try the repair.

If no to either of these points. Personally I would fit a new one. Worth it for the time alone that it takes to sort it next time round.

Mike 8) 8) 8) 8)

Phil C

#13
24 Feb, 2021, 11:21
Thanks Mike. Dave also said he'd go for a new one. I'm going to get a cheap little soldering iron and see how I get on, and if it doesn't go very well then just buy a new stator. Should be interesting. Actually someone told me this morning that new 6volt, 3 wire stators are a bit hard to come by at the moment.
Phil

Pete A10

#14
24 Feb, 2021, 13:49
I seem to recall that there was a section in the Rupert Ratio book that specifically dealt with fitting new wiring to a B40 stator. It was quite fiddly but not especially difficult - the main thing was to get enough wire exposed on the stator to get a good soldered joint. If the bike has been running ok then the chances are that the stator insulation is ok so definitely worth trying to solder in new wires first. If your soldering is a bit rusty try some practice joints first. Whenever I do any I find it best to tin both wires first so that everything has solder on it before you heat it, and make sure the soldering iron is clean with a good coating of solder on it to conduct the heat into the wires. And plenty of flux to clean it.
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