Author Topic: Conical hub - replacing whole front end  (Read 353 times)

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CROFTY1984

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Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« on: 05 August, 2018, 19:13:25 »
Hello all,
I have an early oil in frame A65.
I understand the conical hub can be made "less bad", but I'm considering just binning it off and going for discs, preferably 2. I'm not worried about originality, other than I'd like right-way up forks and a wire-spoked wheel.

Rather than try to mix parts, I'm thinking of getting a full front end off something so the hub spacing, yokes, mudguard mounts etc are all in the right place. Presumably I'd have to change the steering stem or have one custom made.

Has anyone here done it? what would you recommend? Ideally from something cheap and plentiful. Honda CB? Yamaha Virago? I guess the twin disc Trident would be the obvious answer but there aren't many of them sitting round breakers going for cheap. Don't mind single disc as long as it works well and is an easy fit.

DEREKANDERSON8

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #1 on: 05 August, 2018, 19:34:04 »
It can be a nightmare to get something to fit properly!

I have fitted to my early A65 a real mixture, Kawasaki ER500 yokes, with 35mm Japanese (honda i think) forks, wheel is a TLS CL450 honda which works superbly.

It was a pain to get it to fit, had to shorten steering stem and modify the bearings to fit the BSA headstock.

It started off straightforward but can get messy. I have a set of 41mm Paoli forks from an MZ Scorpion that i fancy using with my tribsa but keep putting it off!

 ;)

Ken Oaff

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #2 on: 05 August, 2018, 20:50:19 »
are fitting a disc front end to my oif Lightning

triumph t140 front end is more or less bolt on but you need a complete front end as yokes are wider

Floating discs are available which should improve braking

Performance machine 4 piston caliper bolts straight onto lower fork leg

A10 JWO

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #3 on: 06 August, 2018, 17:32:52 »
I considered the Triumph Disc set up and changing the whole front end, big problem trying to find one.

Editor

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #4 on: 06 August, 2018, 20:22:10 »
Remember, what you are doing may be considered as 'substantial change to the vehicle' which means it may not be MOT exempt. No
problem if you want to continue having an annual MOT test.
However, if you do want exemption, my advice would be check the back of the V112 and decide whether your mods fall under substantial change or the mods are not considered to be substantial change according to the list.
Look it up on https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/declaration-of-exemption-from-mot.

Chris

Ken Oaff

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #5 on: 07 August, 2018, 07:06:38 »
Putting a 1973 disc front end on a 71 / 72 bike would fall under the category period modifications

I suspect it wouldn't cause any issues on the historic vehicle front

However I always mot my bikes even if they are exempt as if in the event of an accident you do have independent verification that the bike at the mot date was road worthy - insurance companies love loop holes to get out of paying and having no mot gives them a convenient get out clause

Editor

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #6 on: 07 August, 2018, 12:58:06 »
Ken, the official line from the BSAOC sponsor Footman James is despite what the Broker may tell you, the insurance company would not refuse to pay out in the event of an accident if the bike doesn't have an MOT. Even if it has an MOT, they would try to ascertain the roadworthiness at the time of the accident and if it proved deficient, that may affect the amount they will pay. As you say, it only shows roadworthiness on a particular date and mileage.
My comments were more aimed at those folk who want to fit say a complete 2017/18  front end c/w modern forks and disc brakes and still think the bike is MOT exempt. 

Ken Oaff

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #7 on: 07 August, 2018, 16:12:00 »
thanks for the update  which is good news as I am currently insured through Footman James


CROFTY1984

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #8 on: 10 August, 2018, 12:30:14 »
Me too, can't fault them.
I've decided I'm going to go with a complete T140 front end, hopefully that's the easiest route. Even if it costs me an extra hundred quid I'd rather spend the time riding it than messing about and maybe missing a riding season.
Just missed out on one on eBay!
Thanks for the advice everyone.

EDDIE SIMPSON

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #9 on: 10 August, 2018, 18:55:54 »
hello, a t140 disc front end on a bsa a10  was always a common mod to improve braking. its the restoration nutters who removed them. another mod is the later twin leading shoe front brake. i guess a lot of us will now have to have an mot.

Ken Oaff

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #10 on: 10 August, 2018, 21:10:28 »
Vehicles of Historical Interest (VHI): Substantial Change Guidance

Most vehicles manufactured or first registered over 40 years ago will, as of 20 May 2018, be exempt from periodic testing unless they have been substantially changed.

A vehicle that has been substantially changed within the previous 30 years will have to be submitted for annual MoT testing. Whether a substantially changed vehicle requires re-registration is a separate process.




The following are considered acceptable (not substantial) changes if they fall into these specific categories:

changes that are made to preserve a vehicle, which in all cases must be when original type parts are no longer reasonably available;

changes of a type, that can be demonstrated to have been made when vehicles of the type were in production or in general use (within ten years of the end of production);






EDDIE SIMPSON

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #11 on: 11 August, 2018, 11:57:41 »
hi ken, luckily i m not a lawyer. but it  seems triumph disc front ends are ok. no mot required.
if crofty can source a t160 font end all the better as the forks are slightly lower i believe. also steering stop has to be made and the steering damper arrangement thought .

Ken Oaff

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #12 on: 12 August, 2018, 19:34:37 »
Hi Eddie

that's my interpretation T140 /150 /160 front ends all fall with in the 10 year rule

with t140 front ends you can pull the tubes up through the top yoke and lower the front end if you wish

Still to ascertain what to do with the fork stops - they work but have yet to fit tank.......  watch this space

CROFTY1984

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #13 on: 14 August, 2018, 14:03:42 »
Vehicles of Historical Interest (VHI): Substantial Change Guidance

Most vehicles manufactured or first registered over 40 years ago will, as of 20 May 2018, be exempt from periodic testing unless they have been substantially changed.

A vehicle that has been substantially changed within the previous 30 years will have to be submitted for annual MoT testing. Whether a substantially changed vehicle requires re-registration is a separate process.




The following are considered acceptable (not substantial) changes if they fall into these specific categories:

changes that are made to preserve a vehicle, which in all cases must be when original type parts are no longer reasonably available;

changes of a type, that can be demonstrated to have been made when vehicles of the type were in production or in general use (within ten years of the end of production);
Interesting, thanks. My bike is a '71 the front end is off a '75 model bike and I imagine was a relatively common mod back in t'day.

EDDIE SIMPSON

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Re: Conical hub - replacing whole front end
« Reply #14 on: 14 August, 2018, 22:05:41 »
very common to have a t140 front end , 16" rear wheel, peanut tank , apehangars and much chrome on an old a10 in the age of born to be wild.