BSA Owners' Club Forum

The BSA Workshop => Twins => Topic started by: RogerSB on 08 August, 2017, 13:58:52

Title: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: RogerSB on 08 August, 2017, 13:58:52
Jan 1960 Golden Flash and as far as I know pretty well original, apart from service items such as cables, etc.

It has the 6 spring clutch. However, on fitting a new clutch cable (pt no 42-8775), which is apparently the correct one for 1959 - 1962 I had to file the smaller end of the stepped ferrule down considerably to fit in the gearbox abutment hole. See the photos.  The hole in the gearbox abutment is the same diameter right through and smaller than the ferrule on the cable - probably about the diameter of the actual cable end.

The previous owner had the same problem but his solution was to feed the nipple and the cable inner through the centre of a washer so that the ferrule was, at least, held a little more stable against the abutment (as the original smaller part of the stepped ferrule wouldn't go into the abutment hole.

All the clutch cables to fit a 1960 A10 I've seen advertised are the same as the cable I bought. Is it possible that the gearbox is from an earlier or later model, which had a smaller hole in the gearbox abutment?

OK, I've sorted it but I'm puzzled as to why I had to file the fitting on the end of the cable down to fit.

Any ideas?
Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: Bess on 08 August, 2017, 15:29:37
     I think the cable is incorrect, it should end with a ball.

Image A10 4759 is years 1947 to 1959 part no 67-8681, image A10 6069 is years 1960 to 1969 part no 42-8775. Both end with a ball  instead of a trumpet nipple as you have.

Best wishes...
Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: JulianS on 08 August, 2017, 16:25:15
That is a nasty cable - the nipple should fit snuggly in the clutch lever. Looks very poor quality.

But you gearbox inner cover is for FA7 frames and earlier with an adjuster at the gearbox end but not at the handle bar, the hole is threaded 1/4 BSF for screw adjuster. So cable wrong for you gearbox cover. You need the 1959 and earlier cable to go with your gearbox. But the inner might be too short to go with the adjuster at the bar end as well as the gearbox end.

The GA7 frame inner cover was bored to take the ferule on the end of your cable, was not threaded and did not have the slot. This cable was for use with handle bar end adjuster.

Photo shows the gearbox with adjuster.
Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: RogerSB on 08 August, 2017, 19:01:36
Many thanks for both of your informative and quick replies, which has given me a clue as to what might have happened in the past.

The old clutch cable had the adjuster at the lever end of the cable, as also does the front brake cable (see photo). I ordered the clutch cable for a 1960 A10 (from a highly reputable Brit bike retailer - not eBay) and was sent the 42-8775 cable shown in photo. As it was the same as the old cable that I removed I assumed it was correct for my bike. Hence the puzzlement over the fit.

I assumed when I first bought my GF, a couple of months ago, that it had a 4 spring clutch (being 1960) but on checking I see it has the earlier 6 spring one, so it seems my bike being first registered in January 1960 was built with 1959 parts - so may more accurately be a 1959 model.

I think what may have happened sometime in the last 57 years is that someone fitted different levers and cables. I looked at the cables with the adjuster at the gearbox end but I didn't think they were the right ones because my bike had the adjusters at the lever ends and that my GF was 1960 and not 1959.

It seems I need to look for different handlebar levers (ones that do not need the adjusters screwed into them) to suit the earlier clutch and front brake cables.

This is my 3rd GF, having had two in the 1960's but 50 years on it's hard to remember all the small details. It's one I ride and I'm pleased to say it passed it's MOT last month with flying colours. The only comment by the tester was that the throttle should shut off when you let it go. I had to point out that it's not a good idea when you are going up hill and you have to give a right hand signal!

Thanks again chaps.
Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: RogerSB on 08 August, 2017, 19:07:53
As an addendum. Frame no is GA7-40**.  So it puts me in a difficult position when ordering parts.
Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: JulianS on 08 August, 2017, 21:19:46
The clutch was changed from 6 to 4 spring during 1960, from engine DA10 13298 see the parts service bulletin below. So the 6 spring is likely original to your bike.

Handlebar adjusters are right for a GA7 frame.

You could consider some simple mods to keep the bar end adjusters - first you could buy the raw materials and make some cables - if you look at the clutch lever on the gearbox that nipple on your new cable was never going to fit properly, just the wrong shape. Make your own they are always the correct length and fitted with correct fittings, you could fit adjusters at both ends of the cable.

Or you could modify your gearbox inner cover - bore the threaded hole to take the ferrule.

And you could change the front brake cable stop to the unthreaded type. Part 42 5885 is the unthreaded one.

It would not be suprising to find a mix match of parts on a bike after all tose years and not knowing whohas done what and when.
Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: RogerSB on 08 August, 2017, 22:28:37
Thanks JulianS, Good to know levers are correct for my frame number. They look as if they've been on the bike for a long time - with the patina in keeping with the rest of the machine. I'd like to keep it that way if I can and I didn't really fancy the idea of fitting a couple of brand new, shiny levers that would have stood out like a sore thumb.

I just assumed (again) that the nipple on the cable was right for the gearbox adjuster arm. It seemed to fit in nicely so I'm now wandering whether the outer cover or the arm has been changed to a later one. If that is the case then I think the best way for me would be to buy another 42-8775 clutch cable and file the end down again and keep it as a spare. Probably last my lifetime! Also less troublesome than drilling out the hole (which I'd probably mess up). I intend to have a look at the shape of the recess in the arm and the nipple fit tomorrow to see if I can tell.

My front brake is 8" and when I fitted a new cable (42-8771) recently which had the adjuster at lever end I didn't notice the cable stop had any thread inside it (but then I didn't look) . If I do need to go down that route it seems a 42-8732 cable with a hub end adjuster for 1958 A10 (33" outer, 41" inner) is available, so I'll measure my existing one tomorrow and take a look at the cable stop.

The bike hasn't been restored but obviously things have been renewed over the years and has had a few improvements along the way. Belt drive to dynamo, converted to 12v using a V-Reg 2 voltage regulator, Eddy Dow fork dampeners.

Here's a photo of my Nutley Blue Golden Flash I owned in the mid 60's. Another with me astride it in Dorchester when on my way from Plymouth to Portsmouth when serving in the Royal Marines. I used to do the journey on my GF Portsmouth to Plymouth nearly every Friday evening and back again to Portsmouth overnight on Sunday to get back to barracks in time for morning parade. Took about 5-6 hours - as not many dual carriageways and no motorways then in this part of the west country.

Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: JulianS on 09 August, 2017, 11:56:00
Super photos!
Title: Re: Clutch cable ferrule and gearbox abutment puzzle
Post by: RogerSB on 09 August, 2017, 17:37:02
Well, for anyone who may be interested here is my conclusion after the input from JulianS and Bess and my own follow up investigations.

My A10's gearbox abutment lug is the threaded type with a slot in the top for the cable inner to drop into (see photo) so cable pt no 42-8775 is not correct (as pointed out to me) for my gearbox inner cover, which was designed to accept the earlier cable with the adjuster at the gearbox end and not the handlebar lever end.

To change the cable for the earlier one, to suit my gearbox, I would need to change the handlebar clutch lever.

Not to end up with different style levers I would then need to change the front brake lever and then the cable for an earlier type with adjuster at the brake back plate end. Next thing to check was does my 8" front brake have the threaded type of fulcrum pin - answer is no (see photo) so that's not practical.

My conclusion or my guess is: Someone in the past has change the gearbox for the earlier type used prior to 1960 and that was why there was a bodge, with a washer, to be able to use a 42-8775 cable.  My bodge was a refinement of that - and as was pointed out the cable didn't have the right shape nipple to fit the operating arm anyway. I think it might be a Triumph cable passed off as a replacement BSA 42-8775 cable.

My easiest and least expensive choices, it seems, are:-

Buy another 42-8775 cable (making sure it has a nice round nipple to fit the gearbox clutch operating arm socket) and after spending an hour filing the ferrule down to fit the gearbox hole, fit it and keep the one in use at present as a spare.

Or an alternative (as suggested by JulianS) drill out the hole bigger in the gearbox abutment to take the ferrule of the 42-8775 cable.