BSA Owners' Club Forum

General => The Star and Garter => Topic started by: Phil C on 16 August, 2021, 18:36:28

Title: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 16 August, 2021, 18:36:28
I have an oil tap below my oil tank (1965 B40F) to stop wet sumping. But it seeps oil at the joints. I've tried to sort it, smeared sealant on the olives, even renewed the tap ( with an identical type.) Can anyone recommend a leak-proof one please?   Phil
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: JOHNSTONE on 16 August, 2021, 20:18:07
Have you tried PTFE tape.

Regards Rich.
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 16 August, 2021, 20:34:03
Yes
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 16 August, 2021, 21:33:10
Or did I? Maybe I was thinking of it but then thought it might be a bit risky in that the PTFE tape might get into the oilways and cause a blockage somewhere.  Phil
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: chaz on 17 August, 2021, 07:27:29
our B40 has a leak from the tapered joint at the bottom of the oil tank connector, just one of those annoying things, poor design.
best type would be a plain threaded connector no olives, no tapered fittings. same as fuel tap design, 1/4BSP to 1/4BSP.
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 17 August, 2021, 08:51:48
Should I wind some PTFE tape round the olives?
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Mike Farmer on 17 August, 2021, 09:15:14
 :) :) :)
I believe you can get a PTFE spray. Block the pipes, spray the whole joint, take out the pipe blocks, do it up agen. Should work

Mike 8) 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 17 August, 2021, 09:29:35
Thanks Mike. Just had a look online at the wd40 version, which is available at Screwfix. The blurb talks about lubrication and protection but doesn't mention sealing joints. Any thoughts on that, Mike or anyone, please?  (I just don't want to buy it and find it doesn't work!).

And is it better than the tape (which I already have)?

 Phil
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: DAVE BRADY on 17 August, 2021, 09:33:11
Hi Phil,

If you must have a tap then make sure it has the same ID as the specified oil pipe.  I think  the B40 has 5/16 ID rather than 1/4.  Olives do not need PTFE and using it may prevent the olives from doing their job.  Some are brass and take quite bit of compressing, copper olives are easier to compress.  If you use PTFE as a 'belt and braces' back up wrap some on the thread and a bit around the pipe so that as you tighten the nut it seals the thread and where the pipe comes through the nut.
With the PTFE tape you know you have got some where you want it.

Dave.
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Mike Farmer on 17 August, 2021, 13:19:43
 :) :) :) :)

Sorry no idea. I only know of its use in water applications and I've never used it

Mike 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 18 August, 2021, 09:36:34
Mine have been copper olives, but I notice that when I've -  out of desperation - tightened too hard, they have been damaged. But anyway before then the weep of oil was there. I'm not sure I understand how PTFE would work in places other than the olive? I guess if the oil gets past the olive then tape on the thread might prevent it migrating along the thread. But tape on the pipe, unless it was pushed up against the olive? I don't quite get that. If there is enough clearance for the nut to slide along the pipe up to the thread then surely there's enough clearance for oil to get through. If it's a kind of interference fit whereby the nut deforms the tape as it slides up to the thread then is it not going to push against the olive, potentially compromising the olive seal? Overall it's annoying that this (ball-valve) tap just doesn't seem to be oiltight.   Phil
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: JulianS on 18 August, 2021, 11:44:46
If it leaks from new maybe you have a faulty tap so why not speak to the supplier about it.

You could consider lapping the olive to its mating surface.

Or, if you have space, you could consider one of these anti wet sumping valves. Some owners like them others do not. I used a similar valve on my A10 for a while until I sorted the root cause of the wet sumping.

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/393486675614?hash=item5b9da22e9e:g:~eMAAMXQU6tQ~u0Y
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 18 August, 2021, 12:06:03
Thanks Julian. I think I'll try my existing tap once more (I've ordered some new copper olives) and then if it doesn't work I'll get one of the ones you suggest.

Two further questions:
1. How do I do the lapping you advise? A bit of fine grinding paste and just rotate by hand for a minute or two before cleaning well?
2. Regarding the one you kindly sent me a link for, if the ball and spring were to fail at some stage in the future, would that mean it would wet sump, or would the oil system be blocked (which of course would be disastrous)? I assume it would just wet sump?
Thanks again and everyone. Any further thoughts obviously appreciated.

Phil
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: JulianS on 18 August, 2021, 13:09:23
With a petrol pipe joint with an olive type connection I just rotate and press the mating parts together to ease off any posible small irreguarities on the surfaces. It does not take much to stop such a joint sealing.

I used the anti wet sumping valve for a year or so and had no issues with it.
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 18 August, 2021, 13:41:42
Thanks Julian.

Another possible source of the weeping I guess is the part that goes into the oil tank fitting (see photo.)
Looks okay but who knows.

Phil
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: chaz on 18 August, 2021, 15:57:21
thats wher ours is lleaking, if not that part the mating part that comes out of the oil tank fitting.
one of our jobs in the early days was lapping in steam train valves.
grinding compound , keeping the joint faces square walking around chatting until a uniform colour on both parts.

another job for the weekend..
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: chaz on 22 August, 2021, 13:33:06
following this up, rummaging through my airline pipework connectors, I found a Euro connector, a minute on the lathe and Ive just left a small witness to allow the pipe and clamp grip on. could optionally turn a coarse finish to allow grip.
this adaptor is 1/4BSP and deep enough not to worry the joint on the oil tank fitting. seals up with ptfe tape also if you suffer wet sump, a 1/4 to 1/4BSP tap in between.
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 22 August, 2021, 13:37:06
Hi Chaz, Where do you put the PTFE tape? Phil
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: chaz on 22 August, 2021, 14:02:15
on the bottom of the oil tank fitting,  that has the filter on is a 1/4BSP thread and the cone flange, which on mine is damaged and wont seal on the new piece. that cone joint needs to be seated correctly, this piece does away with the cone joint.
I would otherwise use Loctite 542 which is a red joint compound for BSP fittings, we use on vacuum brake joints so is safe.
40-8328 retails at 22.45+vat for the new filter housing, the brass fitting takes the place of 14-042 and 40-8322 1 and 4.97 +vat and cost me nothing .
Title: Re: Oil tap recommendations?
Post by: Phil C on 08 May, 2022, 10:17:10
Just to finish this discussion: Having bought two of those taps, and tried to stop them leaking, in the end I gave up on them and bought a different kind: one from Kingpin Components, with a cut-out switch (see pic.) This one doesn't leak.  Very pleased with it. The cut-out operates so that you can't start the engine unless the oil tap is turned on. But, that said, I think if the ignition key were turned to the emergency setting then you could start the engine even if you'd forgotten to turn the oil on. Can't see me doing that though.    Phil