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Messages - Charles R

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Twins / Re: A65L Crankshaft welded sludge trap access
« on: 07 November, 2017, 17:51:34 »

I am not intending to do any great or numerous journeys on my A65L (when eventually resuscitated) so that's part of the reasoning for not worrying unduly about the sludge trap.  I'll be very surprised if I manage more than 1000 miles a year - there could be peaks but there'll also be troughs in my use.

I also wonder whether the sludge would be fine enough and in small enough quantities to pass through the crankshaft journals without affecting them, as I would expect the filter to deal with them fairly well as they go round the oil loop.

I suppose I'm looking through rose tinted spectacles and hoping to "cure" the crankshaft block without spending a fortune or tearing out what little hair I've got left.

Hopefully my bike will be back on the road before you are able to report on how much gunge your trap has been filled with!

Thanks again for the help.

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65L Crankshaft welded sludge trap access
« on: 07 November, 2017, 12:47:40 »

Thanks for your suggestion.

I live quite close to Draganfly so took it to them for their view.  They were very reluctant to commit to how long it would take, but their view was a minimum of 2 hours and no certainty of success in being able to reinstate it.  I could then be back to square "minus one" with a hole in the crankshaft and another one in my pocket!  I know they are quite busy, so it could be that they didn't really want to do it (though they certainly didn't say so)!

I think the answer (as recommended by you) may be to seek out another machine-shop and get their view to see what sort of process they could carry out to get into the sludge trap area to see what's in there  After inspection I could then decide what's best to do regarding making it good again or simply blanking it off (see later).

With an external cartridge filter and frequently changed modern oils, I can't see that a sludge trap would be necessary - but I'm no expert on this matter.  It seems to me that BSA put the sludge trap in the crankshaft to make use of the centrifugal effect to remove the heavier deposits in the oil but only because the filtration system was so poor.  Any thoughts on simply not bothering with the sludge trap after opening the hole to check everything is good and clean inside the crankshaft?

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65T Fork Slider Length
« on: 07 November, 2017, 12:24:44 »

Before I dismantled the forks I didn't notice any wheel misalignment.  My A65L had done 18,000 miles, but I have no history as to why it was off the road for a number of years before I got it (who knows, it could have been pranged) and reassembled with whatever was to hand.

Unfortunately the dismantling process involved destroying the stanchions as they were so badly corroded!  This means I don't have the stanchions to quickly reassemble the forks to check whether the wheel spindle really does clamp up properly (at right angles to the forks).

Please forgive me asking the obvious, but have you checked the spindle is true?  Is there distortion or looseness in the clamps?  Are the clamping nuts really pulling down fully onto the clamps?  Could a very thin metal shim be placed around the spindle ends to create a better clamp?  The thought of modifying other parts would worry me.

It looks as if a job I've scheduled for later may need to be brought forward - I'm going to have to buy a pair of stanchions and do a "dry" assembly to see what happens to my front end!

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65T Fork Slider Length
« on: 03 November, 2017, 21:58:33 »

I've got a 1970 BSA A65L (pre oil-in-frame) that has a similar problem:

The right fork outer member (Pt No. 97-3934) is 268mm long (10.54") - this is the one with the brake lug.
The left fork outer member (Pt No. 97-3933) is 272mm long (10.71"), ie 4mm longer.
(Dimensions measured with a steel rule and don't include the end caps.)

The part numbers come from the BSA parts list (00-5707 Aug 1969) but I have no way of telling if that's what I've actually got!

The 4mm difference would try to put the wheel spindle out of alignment.  In practice it would be pulled into alignment when the fork end caps are bolted on.  This would then put slightly different compressions on the fork springs.  This just doesn't sound right.  Id like to know if the discrepancy is acceptable or whether I have a problem (incorrect part from a previous repair?).

Before I dismantled the forks I hadn't noticed anything untoward, though I got the bike as a semi basket case so never saw it in a running state and it could have had all sorts of hidden issues.

The photos shows the offending items, though I could have done a better job on the photos to show more detail!

Is it a coincidence that these outer members have a remarkably similar difference to yours?

Is it anything to do with compensating for the brake forces being taken up by only one of the outer members?

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65L Crankshaft welded sludge trap access
« on: 02 November, 2017, 17:05:08 »
Thanks Julian

Which thread type?  Whitworth?

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65L Crankshaft welded sludge trap access
« on: 02 November, 2017, 16:50:12 »
Thank you all for your thoughts.

I would like to drill through and discover what's lurking:
 a. have they left the sludge trap still in there?
 b. is it clean in there?
 c. can the thread be reinstated?  (By the way, anyone know the thread size & type?)

Depending on what's found, ideally I'd like to reinstate the thread and fit a sludge trap plus plug.  Otherwise, as has been mentioned, seal it up again without a sludge trap so as to allow an external cartridge filter to do its job.

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65L Crankshaft welded sludge trap access
« on: 02 November, 2017, 11:41:36 »

I don't know anyone locally with a floor standing pillar drill or anything approaching it.
I live near Halesworth/Harleston on the Suffolk/Norfolk border.

I'm still intrigued as to why it was welded.  This would have been done about 40 years ago and the motor has never been used since.  Perhaps there was a school of opinion that the sludge trap was not useful if an external filter was fitted but, even so, why weld the hole up?

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65L Crankshaft welded sludge trap access
« on: 01 November, 2017, 15:58:01 »
Thanks for the reply Julian.

I was intending to use a compressed air line to give it a good blow through after putting in some scavenging oil and letting it rest for a day or two.
After that I was going to set up a feed to the bushed bearing feed hole and see how freely the oil moves through to each big end.

BUT before all that I'm going to try and drill through the weld using tools in my shed.  I need to jury rig my bench drill press so it hangs over the bench then set up a solid table under it to give me the necessary clearance to hold the crankshaft under the drill bit.  Setting up will not be simple!

I still don't know why it was welded!

Cheers Charles

Twins / Re: How original for an age related plate?
« on: 01 November, 2017, 14:50:46 »
I meant to finish off by saying that you can register it as a complete non-runner, as I did.  The fact that it was never registered in the UK shouldn't create any problems in the process.

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: How original for an age related plate?
« on: 01 November, 2017, 12:43:17 »
I had a similar issue with my A65L 1970.  I obtained a dating certificate via the BSAOC with half a dozen photos of the "barn find" loosely assembled so it could be seen to be an A65L plus photos of the frame and engine numbers.  Having got the dating certificate I applied to the DVLA and without any queries from them and in a reasonably quick time I got the original registration number but as "not transferable".

For me it turned out to be remarkably painless.

Cheers Charles

Twins / A65L Crankshaft welded sludge trap access
« on: 01 November, 2017, 12:35:08 »
A65L 1970 (last of oil-in-tank)

Has anyone seen this before?  See photo of welded up sludge trap access (yes I know, it's a bit rusty too, but one thing at a time!).
I can't understand why anyone would wish to weld up the entry point when it could simply have a threaded cap fitted (loctited if thought necessary).
Now I've got the problem of what to do about it.

There are three obvious options:
1. buy a replacement crankshaft - not easy & quite expensive even as a used item (would need regrinding, new shells, etc)
2. re-machine the hole and tap it (difficult alignment problem) - also quite expensive as expect it to take about 3 hours
3. ignore the weld and fit it as it is!  (I will be fitting a cartridge oil filter, so sludge should not be an issue.)

Any comments or suggestions?

Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65L oil pump woes
« on: 25 October, 2017, 18:45:14 »
Dear All
Thank you for your help on this matter.
Regarding the engine failure, I only got the info third hand, as the person who sold me the bike (I knew him through work & it was an absolute bargain) said he was helping out someone who wished to get it out of their shed!  I was simply told that the engine had seized and that it had been re-bored etc.  So it could have been poor oil pressure!!
I've spent this afternoon in my shed looking at it, scratching my head and all else that happens in a shed before actual work commences.  The penny dropped - how about a Dremmel?  Well, that's exactly what I've done using a grinding disc that just fitted in the slot.  The slot has been eased by, perhaps, 0.002" to 0.003" and, hey presto, no more binding.
The pump has been completely dismantled, thoroughly cleaned and put back together again with a good dose of 3-in-1.
It runs completely smoothly and spins up perfectly when driven by an electric drill.
Thanks again for helping me think through this matter.
Cheers Charles

Twins / Re: A65L oil pump woes
« on: 25 October, 2017, 10:48:53 »
Hadn't dared to consider anything like that!  But, it's a thought!
Not sure how to get enough pressure on the grinding paste onto the inside surface of the groove to remove up to 0.005" off that face.  I had considered a needle file - the steel is quite hard, so it will need a lot of pressure applied.  (Haven't tried it yet as I've temporarily misplaced my needle files!)
Another method might be to temporarily fit the driving spindle with some grinding paste on the relevant face of the slot and then rotate it with a drill to see if it grinds that face.  As the driving spindle is isolated by an O ring from where the pump gears are, I suppose there should be little danger of the grinding paste getting into the pump itself.  If it works, I can strip the pump down again (I'm getting very slick at doing it!) and clean everything really well before reassembly.
I suspect it may be difficult to remove enough material with the grinding paste to make a significant difference - but it may be worth a try.
Cheers, Charles

Twins / Re: A65L oil pump woes
« on: 24 October, 2017, 16:06:06 »
Hi Julian
Thanks for your response.
I've connected a simple equivalent to the driving spindle that allows me to turn it by hand.  The pump I've got seems to run beautifully smoothly when turned without the driving spindle fitted.
The thought of spending 300 on something that may be OK doesn't sit well with me, though I do appreciate the sentiments regarding that a duff pump would be a disaster!
Cheers Charles

Twins / Re: A65L oil pump woes
« on: 24 October, 2017, 15:59:54 »
Thanks Bess,
Interesting that build standard issues have been recognised.  I haven't got a copy of Classic Bike (I subscribe to Real Classic), so I can't see the detail of what they may be saying.
As a first stab I'm going to see if I can find a local machine shop that will ease the slot to provide a more centralised engagement.  (I could set about it with a file, but that would be pure butchery!)
Cheers, Charles

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