BSA Owners' Club Forum

General => The Star and Garter => Topic started by: j_d on 03 October, 2017, 09:46:02

Title: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: j_d on 03 October, 2017, 09:46:02
I have owned this A65 for many, many years, but it has just come to my attention that when I surrendered the old green logbook for a V5 the frame number was incorrectly entered into the system. The suffix numbers are correct but it has been recorded with an A30 prefix rater than A50.

Both the engine and frame numbers are as as per the original green logbook, which I still have. However, the book has been folded and the fold obscures the frame number somewhat, which probably led to the mistake in the first place.

Will correcting this with the DVLA be straight forward or will I be opening a can of worms that could lead to the bike needing to re-registered?

Any advice will be gratefully received.

Thanks!!

jd
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: STAR TWIN on 03 October, 2017, 10:02:34
A can of worms may well be opened. DVLA seem to be going through a somewhat inflexible phase just now. Just possibly they might be helpful OR you may have to go through the whole tedious process of applying for an age related number - and losing your original registration.
Bring back helpful local offices.
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: j_d on 03 October, 2017, 10:43:04
Thanks! Much as I feared - a touch of Russian Roulette, I think I'll let sleeping dogs lie until it becomes an issue. The old girl has become a family heirloom, so no plans on selling .....
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: MOUNTAINHOP on 04 October, 2017, 03:06:32
I've had my 55 A10 since 1984 , over the years i had lost the registration document, i have changed address so i sent off for a new one with the new details, they asked for pictures of the frame engine numbers, so had to paint stripper a few coats of paint from the frame neck to reveal the number. sent the photos off. I received a letter back to say my reg is now "VOID" because the frame number doesn't match their records. and they wouldn't tell me what number they had. with this letter came a wad of forms for applying for a Q plate. I haven't even looked at the forms, i've been walking the hills , why why me? . I've had that bike 32 years , 32 years of my life just erased by a little man at the DVLA and replaced with a Q. I can't now even go for a ride to forget about it, I need counselling or help group.
So no, never contact the DVLA , they are evil gremlins that relish in stealing your happiness and must be avoided at all costs.
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: Mike Farmer on 04 October, 2017, 10:30:09
HI

Write to CEO DVLA, Your local MP and the minister for transport. Hassle them hassle them. It probably wont work but if enough of us do it maybe, just maybe, someone will start to listen. Ha bloody ha.. ::)

In this time with the super computerised systems, as long as everything on the V5 is properly entered, by them, there is absolutely no need or reason for "Q" plates. When I put this to them the answer was Quote "Its not as simple as that" Red rag to a bull. That phrase means ---OK, you have a good point but I really cant be bothered to get off my donkey and do anything about it.  We are AGENCY--we are next to INFALLIBLE

There really should be an ombudsman (or is there one already) to deal with this type of thing. I will look into this aspect and come back.

Mike 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: JulianS on 04 October, 2017, 10:38:23
Consider applying for an age related plate rather than the "Q" plate.

Is there anything unusual about the number - does it look like a BSA number and in the appropriate sequence for 1955. Sometimes numbers and letters have been misread and misrecorded- S mistaken for 5 , 2 mistaken for Z, 7 mistaken for Z, C mistaken for G and sometimes numbers missed out because of faint stamping or thick paint, others as well.
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: MOUNTAINHOP on 05 October, 2017, 03:49:29
Having looked up the numbers how they appear on my frame , they do actually tally with a 54 A10, so at some point before 84 i believe the frame has been changed with an older frame, one of the first swing arm models. I just never thought to check it. But DVLA have said the bike is unidentifiable and won't budge on that decision. i argued it can be dated, he didn't like that and was having none of it. and they wont tell me the numbers they have on record, so i cant even argue that a 6 could be an 8 or whatever . made me feel like a criminal but all i was trying to do was update my address details like a good citizen. Wish i hadn't bothered now.
The option is to go the dating certificates route regardless, to try and convince DVLA with evidence, but it has borrani wheels and rear 15" bobber, which obviously aren't original , and an A65 tank. would that be considered as not a true marque? it does have the old style single sided front hub and original forks. 

I get the feeling they are just writing off history and handing out Q plates for any bike that doesn't fit their overly strict criteria, just to increase their road tax revenue.
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: DEAN SOUTHALL on 05 October, 2017, 07:43:05
, but it has borrani wheels and rear 15" bobber, which obviously aren't original , and an A65 tank. would that be considered as not a true marque? it does have the old style single sided front hub and original forks. 


I am not suggesting you borrow some A10 wheels and tank while you sort out registration.
 ;)
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: Mike Farmer on 05 October, 2017, 09:38:59
Hi.

I certainly would not suggest borrowing but: -

If A50 wheels fit you can borrow mine for a short time. Where are you.

Mike 8)
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: JulianS on 05 October, 2017, 10:36:37
Unfortunately when the reords were computerised in the 1970s nobody checked that the numbers on the old documents matched the numbers on the bike and I think that this is probably how your V5 got the wrong frame number.

Do you have any old MOT certificates which show the frame number - numbers have been included on MOT for the past 25 years or more - not unusual for testers to copy the number from the V5 rather than read from the frame - you may actually have the V5 frame number.

It is worth getting a dating certificate from the BSAOC then you will know exactly what you have and will then be able to consider your options.
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: MOUNTAINHOP on 10 October, 2017, 13:30:11
Hi.

I certainly would not suggest borrowing but: -

If A50 wheels fit you can borrow mine for a short time. Where are you.

Mike 8)

Thats very kind of you Mike , I'm in Portsmouth. I think I'm going to restore the bike to standard and aim for an age related plate, it wont need a lot of bits. No way am i sticking a Q plate on her, that would be like wearing a fake rolex or wearing an armani suit with Asda socks and pants.
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: TTJOHN on 12 October, 2017, 08:21:51
I once had a bike that was a 1983 machine, imported from Italy, when the log book came it was a 1963, I wasn't going to complain, (free tax etc) I can stand a mistake once but not twice. ;D ;D
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: griffo on 13 October, 2017, 08:09:48
Having fun registering my Bultaco Sherpa from 1972. Had it for years and it has never been registered. Got so far but Swansea want a Nova certificate...  Who in turn want full certificate of confirmity in English . As Bultaco ceased making these or any bikes in the seventies , more chance of plaiting fog. Got a copy of the Spanish import doccuments that relate to year of manufacture , possibly acceptabe they say. Last thing from them was please telephone us... Number is not accepting calls at present... Think there are 'jobs worth' type working in government departments trying to keep their jobs....  >:(   Griff
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: griffo on 13 October, 2017, 18:36:42
  Bit of success.. Got Nova certificate so now just got to get Bultace to re-write the conformation letter and say the proof of age etc. was by photographic evidence. They have signed the photo's as correct for the bike but not put it in the letter.. Must check all full stops and commas before re submitting. Ah well they are looking after their jobs ? ? ?    ::)   Griff
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: griffo on 02 November, 2017, 08:05:49
Sent the reply with all paperwork checked and re-checked.. It came back saying they could not find the NOVA reference number. Called (yes spoke to a human being) NOVA who said they could not find the reference but it had been registered. They suggested I re-apply for NOVA. Did so and 2 hours later had an e-mail from them to say to call them. Seems they had had a duplicate application from me . (Surprise). They claimed a glitch on the system and had cleared it so would scrap the second application and to carry on with the first reference numbers... Here's hoping as paperwork is now re-submitted... Sods law will be applied and a require a vehicle inspection before registration... Griff
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: JAMES_FANNING on 13 November, 2017, 06:13:26
Definitely a can of worms unless you enjoy protracted discussions with DVLA. I was reregistering a bike for Historic class when I thought I'd be helpful in rectifying a frame number anomaly on the old V5C at the same time - DVLA required a verification from the marque owners club (Norton) , which they duly did for a fee after paying me a personal visit. Result was I eventually got the new Historic class V5C from DVLA after a few months , and with the original frame number anomaly still quoted ! Best let sleeping dogs lie.
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: Ken Oaff on 14 November, 2017, 15:37:45
had an issue with dvla with a bike I imported into the uk

they incorrectly copies the vin number down incorrectly

it took years to sort out and eventually they did rectify their error

however as bike was from nz it had a 17 digit alloy tab with the number pop riveted to the frame, as their computer system will only accept 17 digit numbers

can I get DVLA to change the chasis number to that stamped on the frame, no they insist on continuing to use this 17 digit  number

Have two bikes like this, one is an extremely copllectable model with matching numbers, unfortunately the V% has a garbage number on it.......  but the engine and frame numbers are cherry and they do match
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: griffo on 14 November, 2017, 19:11:16
Now on the 5th reply to DVLA and possibly  making progress after a chat with the most charming fellow. I was all nice and controlled and it seems that the problem could be solved (NOVA cock-up). Lets hope the log book arrives this week. Bet it's an inspection job first ! ! !  ::)    Griff
Title: Re: Correcting DVLA Error - Opening a Can of Worms?
Post by: griffo on 18 November, 2017, 20:56:22
Yes the bultaco is now registered.. Got it right in the end. Had a telephone call to Swansea to a most helpful chap. Discussed the case and told me where to forward the paperwork to and hey presto the jobs a gud-un... anybody want to but a 250cc Bultaco trials bike ?   Griff