BSA Owners' Club Forum

General => The Star and Garter => Topic started by: EDDIE SIMPSON on 21 September, 2017, 22:29:15

Title: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: EDDIE SIMPSON on 21 September, 2017, 22:29:15
just been rolled by the dvla over a nice registration number on a a10 plunger. registration is on their website so i thought an older type blue v5 would suffice. sent of bottom slip. vender [66 year old who owned it for 30 years] sent top part all signed etc. the application went to central casework group who asked for proof. frame number, number plate and most bits of bike .photos sent. now they cant issue a v5 as parts do not constitute a roadworthy vehicle. when restored apply again and advise on the next process.
so dvla cant issue a v5 to a car without an mot? not roadworthy.
choose one of the following options?
get a car? buy your number plate? or pay your money and do as your told?
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: Mike Farmer on 22 September, 2017, 08:45:52
Hi. Too late for you but the best thing in these circumstances is to get the seller to obtain a new V5 prior to selling. He is entitled to it but afraid that you are not.

It can still fail.

Mike
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: EDDIE SIMPSON on 22 September, 2017, 19:56:25
hi mike,
yes with hindsight i could of played the system better. obviously honesty is the worst policy with the dvla.
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: Mike Farmer on 23 September, 2017, 10:36:01
HI

The situation with regard to DVLA appears to be getting worse. Its now at the point where you need the level of evidence required for conviction in a murder trial.

So if after very careful consideration you (or anyone else) considers themselves hard done by do this: -

Write to the CAO DVLA Swansea. Write to the minister of transport and write to your local MP.

It may not work but but but  if we load them up enough maybe someone will listen. Trouble is they have the big guns. The longer we just sit back the longer it will go on and the worse it will get.

Its almost as if there is an orchestrated movement to stop restorations without going down the "SVA full test route"

Best

Mike
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: DEAN SOUTHALL on 23 September, 2017, 12:47:33
I am framing the letter I got from DVLA a few months ago. I had noticed that the V5 for my Super Rocket stated the Make as BSA Super Rocket and that the 'Model' had been left blank. I thought it worth getting corrected to avoid any probelsm in the future.

DVLA's response was that they could not change the V5 as BSA had not issued a code for Super Rocket (!?). trying to be helpfu, I guess, they suggested that if I wanted to pursue the matter I should contact BSA directly.

YCNMIU

I think we've identified a training issue!
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: Mike Farmer on 23 September, 2017, 18:29:50
Hi

I think we've identified a serious issue that is going to take some revolutionary thinking to get it sorted. A few individuals are not going to achieve anything. Even an individual Owners Club would not carry sufficient power or clout to get anything sorted.

My thoughts are that it will take a very serious joined up approach by ALL the many clubs to achieve anything down this line. AND it will need some big hitters.

Some thought as to what is trying to be achieved and what might be achievable. Then a powerful leader.

My thoughts are running ahead at the moment. but I am seriously blocks by the uptight and  intransigent stance adopted the system.

I think its not only a lack of training but a lack of knowledge and a total lack of interest. Obviously not taught at university. Further the argument that if you tick all the boxes correctly. then you will be OK; no longer holds good

We'll see

Mike 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: DEREKANDERSON8 on 23 September, 2017, 21:16:07
The system relies upon the information that was registered in 1984 approx, any registration not on the system after that time is disregarded and seen as not known!

I recently purchased a Tribsa that had been liberated from its barn dwelling after some 30 odd years and has a 3 letter 3 number registration after enquiring at DVLA for the v5 its not on the system, no surprise there!

I will have to get it roadworthy, mot (on frame number) and insure then get dating certificate and apply for registration and may be able to keep the original now non transferable number.  :P

Happy days!

derek
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: A10 JWO on 24 September, 2017, 16:27:00
I bought a BSA this year with no log book. The owner died five years ago and the papers were lost. The bike was in boxes and had been off road many years before he died. The engine and frame numbers matched ( fortunately ). I completed a V62 and sent off a cheque for 25. I got a V5 with the transferable number within 3 weeks. It transpired the guy bought it new in 1971 and probably would have had the old log book as he always lived in the same house. I consider myself very lucky with the DVLA and the number plate is worth more than what I paid for the bike. RIP previous owner.
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: Mike Farmer on 24 September, 2017, 21:13:38
Hi.

That's bril.

It almost seems that it is entirely dependant upon whose desk it lands on. Dunno but I hope my luck runs that way.

Mike
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: Editor on 25 September, 2017, 16:49:14
I'm glad I looked at this post as it reminded me to get the blue V5C I have for the Thunderbolt renewed with a red one. Just phoned DVLA and bingo! they will send me a new one in a couple of days
Chris
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: EDDIE SIMPSON on 25 September, 2017, 17:51:52
thanks for support against the dvla. bike is on national computer even now. at least i have the possibility of retaining the original number as luckily i bought a complete bike. i m assembling it now without any restoration which is not what i wanted and am aiming for the spring for it to be ready. it was annoying that i did everything dvla asked, then central casework moved the goalposts. so there is a politburo within the dvla innards. regards politicians ; bedsits, pedal power and driving around in milkcarts are the coming mans, new horizon . we are almost there in london except for the lorries, buses and aircraft.
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: MALCOLM.JOHNSON on 27 September, 2017, 21:33:32
Coming to the end of a restoration of an A7, which came to me dismantled, no papers but still fitted with the front and rear number plates. One of my first jobs was to get an "information only" dating certificate from our man Steve Foden. this fortunately showed it to have its original engine, so obtaining an age related number should not pose a problem. This certificate also detailed the original m/c dealer who sold the machine with date. I also got in touch with the Kithead Trust who hold many of the registration number records. They matched the registration on the machine and supplied evidence to show, that the dealer on the dating certificate, had reserved 4 sequential registration numbers, which include mine, on the appropriate date for his business. However because there is no reference to a frame number, I will still not be able to reclaim the original number!

I am not bothered about it being transferable, but I feel it is sad that in such a case, that the DVLA has to be so rigid. Much of this has been brought about by abuse of transferable registrations over the years. Once sorted and if available, I might try and buy the number to put it on the machine, just to set the record straight.
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: EDDIE SIMPSON on 28 September, 2017, 21:42:38
Hi Malcolm,
I don't think the dvla will sell you your own reg number as they know it was previously issued.
They will direct you to their auctions where you bid against car dealers and rich directors for similar plates.
We are the obvious losers in this government business. Would Corbin improve the situation or hurry to get us all off the road?
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: Editor on 30 September, 2017, 16:04:01
Malcolm,
This is a fairly recent rule applied by the DVLA. It's all about the chassis (in our case frame) number and evidence that the Registration number was applied to a specific chassis number. Unfortunately for you the local council involved, like many of them, would have written the chassis no. on the original buff log book, but didn't bother to include it in their records when registering it.
They have tightened up on the procedures after it's rumoured, an un-named historic vehicle owners club was found to be bending the rules and spirit by certifying 'historic' examples of the marque against an original reg.no but the vehicles had been rebuilt with virtually all new parts including a new chassis. The few have spoiled it for the many.
I can understand the DVLA's viewpoint as no-one can actually prove which of the 4 numbers the dealer reserved was allocated to yours?
They don't sell old numbers, only ones that were never used which is where the stock of age related numbers comes from. I asked many years ago about buying the reg of my wife's first car and they said no, as the vehicle has been scrapped and therefore the reg is now defunct.
They're not being awkward or mean, they are just securing a system which avoids the possibility of fraudulent use of numbers.
Title: Re: "resist the dvla, and i thought it was the u.k. ?"
Post by: MALCOLM.JOHNSON on 09 October, 2017, 21:21:19
I personally do not understand the DVLA`s point. How else could my machine physically bear the number plates as one of the four allocated registrations reserved by the dealer at the same time BSA factory records show it despatched to the very same dealer - I cannot imagine any scenario to achieve that. At some stage they will have to issue a registration for the machine, age related, Q, or even if I could prove a link to the chassis number, it would still be non - transferrable. So if I can show a good connection to the machine for that number - which I believe I can, what does it matter if they issue that number, because no one can actually make a monetary gain, but importantly to those of us interested in old motorbikes, the history of the machine stays in tact, despite the fact that the machine has not been used for years. The bike will need a number so it might as well be its original one!